Question about mechanics of SRS for cards in Core 10000

Help
#1

Could someone clarify for me how the SRS manages cards with multiple layouts, specifically those in the Core 10k? I notice that a card will level down if I get even one aspect of it wrong, but does this mean that the SRS will go down on even those I got right?

For instance, with 自棄, if I correctly answer the english -> japanese and japanese -> english, but get the reading wrong, I’ll go down a level. Does this mean that I’ll be asked for the english-japanese and japanese-english the next session as well? Or will those particular layouts get pushed to the back of the deck because I answered them correctly, and I’ll only be asked for the reading which I originally got wrong?

#2

Cards progress overall. If you get any layout wrong, the card drops (all layouts included). So you’re always quizzed on all layouts.

#3

Okay, that’s what I suspected. So what’s the option for doing it the other way? Would it be possible to run 3 separate instances of the core 10k deck with each set to only one layout?

#4

No but there is something close that you can do. If you turn on Delay Card Siblings, you effectively mimic having x decks running simultaneously.

What it does is: if you do EN->JP now and your delay is set to 24 hours, the JP->EN layout only comes up 24 hours later. So it’s like you are doing two decks but leveling them up together, which may actually be better than completely separate decks.

The relevant setting is on the Deck Settings page.

#5

Thanks for replying - if I correctly understand how your suggestion would work it sounds like that might be a v good solution for someone whose main problem is that the cards they know well keep reminding them of the cards they don’t. But my issue is: there are 10000 cards in that deck, each with multiple layouts, and I’m spending a lot of my time running through ones that I already know. Every time I get one card wrong, at least 2 others (possibly more, depending on how audio prompts are treated) are dumped back in at the same level, which defeats the point of SRS only asking you to remember something at the point you’re about to forget it.

What about copying across the 5 different striations of the core10k vocab/sentences decks into 5 separate private decks? Would that be possible?

#6

Community Deck data is not available for export in order to protect Creator content. So no, this is not possible.

I think perhaps you may want to consider viewing the item holistically as opposed to viewing individual layouts as an item. If you consider that a vocab is a reading AND a meaning and then getting either of them wrong is the same as not knowing the vocab (this is inherently true), rather than splitting them into two in a way that doesn’t help the end goal of literacy, I think you will benefit a lot in the long run even if it’s a litte painful to being with.

As far as I know, a one-size fits all SRS is not proven to be effective only if the intervals are strictly adhered to, but they are eminently convenient and efficient on the whole. So, yes, you should care about SRS, especially in the lower SRS levels, but don’t stress over it if you see an item too often. The bigger concern is seeing an often far too late, especially towards the start of the SRS queue.

#7

I understand that it was offered in good faith, and I appreciate the attempt to be helpful, but “you shouldn’t stress over it” is not actually a useful contribution here.

For some people, the holistic approach is preferred, and I respect that it works well for them. On the other hand, I think you will find plenty of linguists - both in a professional and casual sense - who take the opposite opinion that actually comprehension and production are two different skills. In my case, my reading comprehension happens to be light years ahead of my listening and language production, so it makes much more sense to seek a separated approach.

I think if there is no way to do this on the kitsun platform as it currently stands, then that’s a shortcoming that limits its usefulness, and I hope the developers are able to take another look at it in future.

#8

What you’re asking for is literally the same deck where there is an individual card for each layout rather than multiple layouts per card. This is something you can make yourself if you like. It’s not a Kitsun limitation, it’s just the way this particular deck was made.

To make it yourself, you could export a 10k deck from Anki and import it into Kitsun.

#9

Yes, in the absence of a button that says “treat layouts as individual cards for the purposes of srs” that’s probably what I’ll end up doing, but I maintain that it would be better to have the button than to manually recreate a deck that already exists

#10

There is an alternative 10k that you could use separately if you wish. It’s available in the Community Center.

https://kitsun.io/store/detail/5b6a68aa8777fe5dc9ed45c3

#11

Thanks!

#12

I highly recommend against it to be honest. What will happen is that cards for the same word will still come in reviews around the same time (as you’ll probably learn them together), leading for them to spoil you constantly. That alternative deck was a request of mine a few years ago, I did it that way, and I don’t think it was a good way to learn.

I’d rather just not learn ENG-JP than spoiling myself constantly and not learning any of the layouts that well :confused:

The alternative would be to postpone learning ENG-JP for now and just learn meaning and readings.

#13

Please believe me when I say I’m really not trying to be unfriendly here, but once again, to be absolutely clear, I’m not looking for advice on how best to learn Japanese in this thread. I’m N1 qualified and have been learning for the better part of a decade. I have a good idea by this point of the methods that work best for me, and am not suggesting that anyone else adopt them. I have a very specific use for the Core10k set, which is to use a relatively well curated resource including pre-packaged audio cues to cut down on the time I spend creating my own decks for long term language retention. I’m simply trying to find out more about the technical structure of kitsun so that I can better use it for my own language learning purposes.

2 Likes
#14

Everyone studies differently so that’s definitely a valid comment to make, I don’t think anyone is going to try to force you to do it a specific way either ^^

Regarding your problem, you could take that deck as an extra, but what you could also do is do the original deck with just 1 layout (per vocab and per sentence) enabled, then once you’re through, you could reset the progress on all cards and do another layout.

1 Like